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If you don't mind me adding a few observations (for those who want them, not to be nit-picky):

The Fury has "just barely enough" cooling capacity, but "enough." The mechanical thermostat (flow regulator) keeps the engine temperature constant, flowing more or less coolant volumetrically as needed. If the flow regulator (thermostat) is fully open and there is insufficient air flow over the radiator to keep the coolant "not hot" the radiator fan turns on. On scorching hot days under load the Fury's cooling system manages, though doesn't have much headroom.

I understand @K3v1n wants to add the system in parallel, not series, and given the low volume of flow it should not really affect the cooling system (unless it breaks).

Water pumps are under more stress (load) when they pump more fluid, similar to a vacuum cleaner motor spinning slower when the hose is not blocked. Pumping an increased volume requires an increased amount of power.

Reducing the operating temperature is done by changing the mechanical thermostat to one that opens at a lower temperature. Owners having their ECU reflashed generally had the radiator fan "on" temperature set to the mechanical thermostat "full open" temperature; it didn't hide the use of liquid cooling as well but gave the system more cooling headroom and extended oil life.

There's really not a "more efficient" cooling system, Honda engineered an amazing, balanced solution. A larger radiator would give more cooling capacity, but in almost all cases isn't needed. (I'm unaware of a Fury overheating.)

Remember I'm an old crusty dude just trying to help, not criticizing anyone's statements.
The fury has plenty of cooling capacity. With the small radiator, it's not over cooled, but unless the day is exceptionally hot, it doesn't reach the set point for the fan on. Even with the lowered set point.

The thermostat is not really a flow regulator. They are a thermal regulator. They are specced by temperature, not flow rate. And the do not gradually open, regulating flow. They hit the specced temp, they open all the way.

The amount of fluid in the system doesn't add extra load to the water pump. No matter how much total volume there is in the system, the pump is always exposed to the exact same fluid amount. Unless the reservoir was elevated, then the head pressure would go up, but this is basically at the same level.

A change in the open temperature of the thermostat not alter the operating temperature. Once it opens, the temp will go to the operating temp. The only way to lower the operating temperature is to increase the amount of dynamic cooling provided by the cooling system ie: bigger radiator, higher volume pump. But the engine and ECU are designed to work in that range and lowering it would reduce efficiency, probably power as well and lower mileage.
 
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The fury has plenty of cooling capacity. With the small radiator, it's not over cooled, but unless the day is exceptionally hot, it doesn't reach the set point for the fan on. Even with the lowered set point.

The thermostat is not really a flow regulator. They are a thermal regulator. They are specced by temperature, not flow rate. And the do not gradually open, regulating flow. They hit the specced temp, they open all the way.

The amount of fluid in the system doesn't add extra load to the water pump. No matter how much total volume there is in the system, the pump is always exposed to the exact same fluid amount. Unless the reservoir was elevated, then the head pressure would go up, but this is basically at the same level.

A change in the open temperature of the thermostat not alter the operating temperature. Once it opens, the temp will go to the operating temp. The only way to lower the operating temperature is to increase the amount of dynamic cooling provided by the cooling system ie: bigger radiator, higher volume pump. But the engine and ECU are designed to work in that range and lowering it would reduce efficiency, probably power as well and lower mileage.
Thanks
 

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@Kbuskill and @WI_Hedgehog maybe we should have the name of this forum changed to the "Old and Crusty Fury Forum" as it would reflect the member base and the views held a lot better than now. ;)
A bunch of new members are younger, and there's a good handful of women here, so that may not resonate well.
 

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Respectfully, as I've come to understand you're an "old & crusty" wrench also (if you don't mind me saying that),
The fury has plenty of cooling capacity. With the small radiator, it's not over cooled, but unless the day is exceptionally hot, it doesn't reach the set point for the fan on. Even with the lowered set point.
1.) There are plenty of Wisconsin summer days (somewhere between 78°F and 87°F) with average Milwaukee traffic where the fan turns on at traffic lights with the OEM fan setpoint. I'm confident the OEM setpoint was correct because during the IAC Reset I used a calibrated Fluke 87 DMM with a fluid temperature probe in the radiator while monitoring the RPM on a digital strobe light display and the approximate cylinder head coolant temperature with an IR temperature gun. When the ECU was replaced with Ken's reflashed unit having a lower fan setpoint the fan turned on more regularly in city driving (though not annoyingly so). From my experiences, the fan turns on during "normal" driving.

In hotter States temperatures could be 110°F regularly, we even see that in Wisconsin a few days out of the year. Given blacktop--especially new blacktop--gets quite hot on full-sun days, my basis for stating "enough" cooling with "not much headroom" is based on 135°F road-air temperature, a fat guy with a passenger, driving up a long incline. I think that's a reasonable metric as it also accounts for situations like slow ascents up steep mountain roads with a passenger. (Your metric--and waistline--may be different.)

The thermostat is not really a flow regulator. They are a thermal regulator. They are specced by temperature, not flow rate. And the do not gradually open, regulating flow. They hit the specced temp, they open all the way.
2.) While often misunderstood, an automotive style thermostat is a mechanical flow control valve that opens and closes gradually within a defined temperature range to regulate engine temperature and avoid thermal shock. Here's a manufacturer's video showing how this works:

The amount of fluid in the system doesn't add extra load to the water pump. No matter how much total volume there is in the system, the pump is always exposed to the exact same fluid amount. Unless the reservoir was elevated, then the head pressure would go up, but this is basically at the same level.
3.) While I was referencing a comment about smaller hoses (in series) making a water pump work harder, with my stating it wouldn't work as hard since there would be less flow (and the pump impeller would mostly freewheel, like a vacuum with a plugged hose), your statement brings up a different point:
The thermostat acts as a flow restricter that changes the pressure in the cooling system, so the coolant pump load will vary with system temperature.

A change in the open temperature of the thermostat not alter the operating temperature. Once it opens, the temp will go to the operating temp. The only way to lower the operating temperature is to increase the amount of dynamic cooling provided by the cooling system ie: bigger radiator, higher volume pump. But the engine and ECU are designed to work in that range and lowering it would reduce efficiency, probably power as well and lower mileage.
4.) The engine operating temperature is determined by the thermostat. Here's a Caltech article that explains it in detail, including items #2 and #3.

This is why a stuck-closed thermostat will cause an engine to overheat. Pro-tip: If your car or truck's thermostat is stuck closed and the engine temperature is rising to unsafe levels, turn your vehicle's heat to the highest temperature setting and the blower to its highest setting. The heater core is a small radiator, and by you turning the fan up all the way you're blowing air over it, cooling the engine off. Setting the cabin temperature setting to "hot" opens the vents to let the heat escape the heater core box, and though you might get hot the vehicle's engine will run cooler. If you drive under 45 MPH and accellerate slowly you can probably "limp" the vehicle to a parts store and replace the thermostat in the parking lot (many stores will lend tools for free with proper ID and a credit card).
 

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You are indeed a prolific googler, I'll give you that.
I've been working on engines since age 4 or so, though admittedly not well in the early years. 🤧

Some of my friends are just amazing when it comes to vehicles, it's a constant learning process. Same with the people here... @Kbuskill for instance is known all the way up in this part of the country for his work; if I mention his name in a large enough group someone is bound to know who he is an have some sort of impressive story.
 

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I've been working on engines since age 4 or so, though admittedly not well in the early years. 🤧

Some of my friends are just amazing when it comes to vehicles, it's a constant learning process. Same with the people here... @Kbuskill for instance is known all the way up in this part of the country for his work; if I mention his name in a large enough group someone is bound to know who he is an have some sort of impressive story.
Do you have anything for swelling? I, suddenly, feel my head getting bigger. :ROFLMAO:
 

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Respectfully, as I've come to understand you're an "old & crusty" wrench also (if you don't mind me saying that),

1.) There are plenty of Wisconsin summer days (somewhere between 78°F and 87°F) with average Milwaukee traffic where the fan turns on at traffic lights with the OEM fan setpoint. I'm confident the OEM setpoint was correct because during the IAC Reset I used a calibrated Fluke 87 DMM with a fluid temperature probe in the radiator while monitoring the RPM on a digital strobe light display and the approximate cylinder head coolant temperature with an IR temperature gun. When the ECU was replaced with Ken's reflashed unit having a lower fan setpoint the fan turned on more regularly in city driving (though not annoyingly so). From my experiences, the fan turns on during "normal" driving.

In hotter States temperatures could be 110°F regularly, we even see that in Wisconsin a few days out of the year. Given blacktop--especially new blacktop--gets quite hot on full-sun days, my basis for stating "enough" cooling with "not much headroom" is based on 135°F road-air temperature, a fat guy with a passenger, driving up a long incline. I think that's a reasonable metric as it also accounts for situations like slow ascents up steep mountain roads with a passenger. (Your metric--and waistline--may be different.)


2.) While often misunderstood, an automotive style thermostat is a mechanical flow control valve that opens and closes gradually within a defined temperature range to regulate engine temperature and avoid thermal shock. Here's a manufacturer's video showing how this works:


3.) While I was referencing a comment about smaller hoses (in series) making a water pump work harder, with my stating it wouldn't work as hard since there would be less flow (and the pump impeller would mostly freewheel, like a vacuum with a plugged hose), your statement brings up a different point:
The thermostat acts as a flow restricter that changes the pressure in the cooling system, so the coolant pump load will vary with system temperature.


4.) The engine operating temperature is determined by the thermostat. Here's a Caltech article that explains it in detail, including items #2 and #3.

This is why a stuck-closed thermostat will cause an engine to overheat. Pro-tip: If your car or truck's thermostat is stuck closed and the engine temperature is rising to unsafe levels, turn your vehicle's heat to the highest temperature setting and the blower to its highest setting. The heater core is a small radiator, and by you turning the fan up all the way you're blowing air over it, cooling the engine off. Setting the cabin temperature setting to "hot" opens the vents to let the heat escape the heater core box, and though you might get hot the vehicle's engine will run cooler. If you drive under 45 MPH and accellerate slowly you can probably "limp" the vehicle to a parts store and replace the thermostat in the parking lot (many stores will lend tools for free with proper ID and a credit card).
Speaking of thermostats, an old mechanic gave me a tip to unstick a stuck thermostat. I had a stuck thermostat on an old bike of mine. As it was made in China a new thermostat could only be obtained from the importer who had no stock or by knowing someone in China who could obtain one from a local dealer. As neither of the two options would get the bike going I opted to use the old mechanic's trick and I boiled the thermostat for 10 minutes in clean water on the kitchen stove. Actually he told me 5 minutes should be enough but I boiled it for 10 just to be sure. After boiling the thermostat I put it back in the bike and to my surprise it worked and I was back on the road.

I'm not sure how well this trick would work with old or corroded thermostats as my one was less than 6 months old but if the thermostat is in good shape it would be worth a try. Especially if you are working on your bike or car when all the parts places are shut.
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Just thought I would help explain where my thought process with this began... so no shit there I was, knee deep in grenade pins... lmao ok so I drive an armada and for Towing on their forums they recommend increasing Trans, oil pans as well as radiator. With the reason spawning from increased fluid capacity for cooling and such. Which is why my idea was, if the system is purged of air I figured n
Is it me or do those helix type water cooling reservoirs look like the T-Virus vials used by the Umbrella Corporation in Resident Evil?
View attachment 241190
Lol where you think I got the idea!
 
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